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BF is in Rehab, and detoxing off Methadone....

Discussion in 'Detoxing from Methadone' started by Cianna, Jul 24, 2014.

  1. Cianna

    Cianna Member


    Last days of Subutex were Monday.Tuesday. He had several things happen at the facility that discouraged him, and then last night left and got drunk. He is back in the facility, but I am not sure that its for very long.

    He is feeling like he was lied to (he literally was) to get him into that facility. Then, (could be the addict manipulating, I don't know...) he tells me the Dr. quit and they couldn't give him any relief.

    He's been hallucinating, seeing demons, and seeing me in the room with him. Last night he was complaining of extreme pain, and fevers. He went back, but is not confident as he was.

    140mgs of Methadone, with the addition of Xanax and booze for well over 2 years. Now he has to deal with getting drunk last night, plus the normal last phases of this portion of his detox.

    I don't know what Im supposed to do. He begged me to find him a different facility, he is really uncomfortable where he is. I have called a couple, but he is in sort of a bind being that he's 3 weeks into detox, had only a couple days of Subutex left. His insurance is balking at the request to change facilities, and the other facilities are very hesitant to take him at this stage in the game.

    I am worried because if I were a clinician (standard medical) I would rate him as in crisis. Hallucinations, and fevers are a major concern, plus the extreme amounts of pain. Yes, I am aware that this can not possibly be a pain free process, however, the type of pain he is describing is excruciating. Is there any other treatment they can supplement the Subutex with to alleviate his symptoms to a level that is just tolerable? He dealt with vomiting, diarrhea, cramping, despondency and flight thoughts successfully for 2.5 weeks.

    I am very afraid that he is going to leave again, use again, and end up dead.
  2. freakedout

    freakedout Moderator

    Hate to tell you this, but what you are describing it what is to be expected. The only options are to quit using opiates or continue on with some form of them. It sounds like he has made his decision. Expect more theatrics if he stays in detox (anywhere.)

    One of the toughest deals of loving an addict is realizing that the only possible way they will quit using is when they decide to on their own. Addicts will "say" they are quitting over and over again or spin things about being "tricked" or "coerced" and often attempt detoxes and rehabs multiple times but actions are the only language you should be listening to.

    Hopefully you don't have too much of your finances and living situation tied up with this guy.

    A straight off jump from 140mg daily of Methadone is an ordeal that requires the addict to have truly decided to quit and oftentimes a detox center that can deal with a multiple month detox. (Due to the length of the detox, very few facilities can handle this. It is more of an expense issue than anything. Insurance companies will not pay for indefinite detoxes in this day and age.) Some folks have made this type of jump on their own and made it. It comes down to the person -- not the detox center.

    Prepare yourself for a bender and migration back to MMT as the most likely near term scenario.

    Tough situation you are in being his supportive other.
  3. Cianna

    Cianna Member

    I agree that words mean nothing and actions are the only thing I want to "hear". I did tell him last night that the only way I would talk to him would be if he went back this am, and the only time I would be willing to discuss plans for a future is when he has completed his inpatient treatment. I have stuck to that. I reiterated to him after he returned to the facility that I am not buying excuses, I don't want to hear them, and the only time he is to be walking out of that facility is to A. go to an inpatient to follow his detox, B. His inpatient treatment plan is complete, or he won't be hearing from me. He tried to push back, telling me that threatening him only makes him want to use, and leave again. I told him I wasn't taking responsibility for his recovery, and I am simply protecting my own health and well being... Having Fibromyalgia, the last 3 days I have gotten a total of 3.5 hours of sleep. That is NOT OK. I don't have access to booze or opiates (I tossed it all Saturday after we agreed that there was no reason to have it around and it was a healthier environment for him to come home to.) to combat musculoskeletal pain I am fighting that is only exacerbated by stress and lack of sleep. When I expressed to him that his response was, "you're not withdrawing from Methadone Cianna, you can't compare the two." My response, (albeit crummy) "I understand, you are suffering far more than any person on the planet, my bad!"

    I actually have none of my finances commingled, and we had our own residences until he went into treatment. At that point I took over his lease, and I have my own income. Fixed it may be, but its guaranteed, and is not affected by his dramatics, neither does he have access to it. I do have his debit card, and full access to his funds. :)

    It is an absolute fact that he was straight up lied to about what he could expect in regards to the facility before entering it. They told him he would be going to a 12 Step Alternative facility, near the beach, all male, with low inpatient population, (8-10 patients that are grouped by age and demographic) private rooms in a 4500 sq foot house, new construction, and as the website declares "some of the safest, most peaceful, and most attractive neighborhoods in Orange County." and no group meeting requirements. He is in a facility where the rooms barely fit 2 twin beds, a small bathroom shared by 2 men in detox (so the highly desired access to showers and baths is limited), the house has limited parking (no where is the 3 car garage with plenty of parking for visors as touted by the site). Additionally, once his detox is done, his only option is the 12 step house, no where near the beach promised, mandatory group daily meetings, with 40+ men in 4 men dorm rooms, 8-10 years his Junior. The location of the facility is not anywhere near that described by the site, and intake counselors.

    Now... ALL that being said... he may have the right to be annoyed and have a feeling of being deceived, I also recognize that he needs to take charge of his recovery, and make things happen. Instead of bitching about it, he needs to be proactive, and make his recovery his priority NOT the reasons he has "failed". Ultimately, no matter what, his choice to use (be it alcohol or opiates) is solely on him. I spent 18 years with an abusive functioning alcoholic - coke head, buried my brother, and never got to have a relationship with my mother due her dying before I graduated high school. I have chosen to not subject myself any further to any of that BS. I am not watching my phone any more, Im not concerning myself with his bemoaning his situation. The ONLY reason this detox is taking longer than planned is because HE CHOSE TO USE. He only has himself to thank for it. It will break my heart to cut ties with him, but that is EXACTLY what I am doing allowing contact only as long as he is in treatment.

    His insurance has ok'd a 90 day stay. I spoke with one of the financial counselors this morning, as I was VERY concerned with his insurance citing "leaving AMA" as cause to not continue to pay for treatment. They confirmed that they manipulate the claim filing to allow for more flexibility in regards to length of detox.

    They have extended his Subutex taper by a couple days, citing "Extreme Withdrawl". With the little field trip to get drunk, how does that affect the critical 7 day Subutex limit?

    I chose to no longer be an addicts GF, but a woman whose BF is an addict. I am not going to worry about him getting upset or jealous if I decide to hang out with friends, or enjoy living my life.
  4. That is a tough place to be . But you sound like you have decided how to have a healthy relationship with him albeit GF or friend...
    I agree with freaked out he is probably on his way back to the methadone clinic.. It is sad because he really could take these 90 days and detox with medical supervision. I understand how you both feel mislead ..But depending on his real motivation he may find others things that he says he was mislead with. Because if he isn't willing to do the work it will be something else to blame..

    I hope he comes around. I am sure their have been people that have left detox and relapsed and then come back and detoxed... Unfortunately that just makes a difficult task sooooooo much harder!

    Thank you for keeping us posted! I am glad you know the importance of taking care of yourself..It is hard but fortunately it is all any of us can Really do! :smile:
  5. sailormom

    sailormom Well-Known Member

    As my oldest son (alcoholic) says, Addicts take hostage's and you are being held hostage. He has to want to get clean for himself and not to pretend in order to keep you or make you happy. You need to keep your options open and not get trapped in his situation. Take care of yourself first.
  6. Cianna

    Cianna Member

    Thanks for everyone's input... It helps me to have a reference source for so many things that I am naive to. I also tell him whats being said here. I fully expected him to push back and say "Those people don't know me, "etc. Thankfully, he hasn't... He has actually just expressed relief that I am able to get good information. Funny, I started this post last night before he called me again... And subsequently was told Im being brainwashed etc. Epic.

    He continues to say that he is "in it to win it", and its his only option. He has come to realize that chances are high he is not going to be able to change facilities, and its up to him to make it successful. He had a couple group meetings today, and I was cautiously optimistic at his lack of complaining.

    He got his phone back again, and says he will not leave. I had spoken with several intake counselors at other facilities, they all expressed that the likely hood is that he will return to MMT. I told him about that being the general consensus, but also told him that, "I know you can be the exception to the rule, if you really want this you can be one of the ones who didnt go back." He assures me that he knows that is true, and that he really does want to be healthy.

    Started to discuss his job situation, as the shop he was at has a high population of addicts, some actively using. I expressed my opinion that I felt that to be an unhealthy environment and suggested transferring to another facility within the company. He started making excuses as to why that won't work etc... My response is simply, "you can keep making excuses or you can own the REAL reason you don't want to transfer."

    Jealousy, irritability, anger, despondency, depression, panic, and almost manic highs... thats the landscape of the last 12 hours. I have to keep reminding myself that its expected, stay positive, don't let him reel me in. Its pretty hard, he has always been very good at manipulating situations to deflect off the issues at hand....

    Going to see him tomorrow, family therapy. Im just as excited as I was last time, but now Im a bit hesitant. Last Saturday we had a great day, then he panicked, we fought that night, Sunday and Monday were terrible for him, and then the day before his last Subutex he bailed out. So, I guess Im cautiously excited now. His last Subutex is going to be Sunday. The staff has been very supportive, in fact one of the guys sat with him until about 2 am talking him out of leaving on Tuesday morning... as soon as that staff member left to go home that was when my BF decided he couldn't take anymore and left.

    I have really got to find some alternative pain management. I only took certain meds when it was unbearable, now I don't have that option... looking for an acupuncturist.. LOL
  7. rsmith46

    rsmith46 Active Member

    10 day sub detox off 140mg of methadone is way too fast, hallucinating, seeing demons, and seeing me in the room with him is from the Zanax withdraw not opiate withdraw. YOU CAN DIE from benzo withdraw and Zanax is the worst. They should be detoxing him with valium and subs slowly seeing as how he is there so long. Shoving a 12 step program down his throut is just plain wrong. Daily group meetings are good but not if they think 12 step AA is the only answer for everybody. I'll bet a staff member spent all night trying to wear him down and get him to stay. They care about the money #1.
  8. rsmith46

    rsmith46 Active Member

  9. Cianna

    Cianna Member

    Im ready to give up. He gets excited about things, tells me a specific plan, then it all changes. He tells me that "they" want this, "they" said that is better. "They" have him on Respirodol. I know that drug, I know the class of drug it is, and I am VERY MUCH not ok with it. When I talked to him on Saturday, he was telling me that he wasnt sure why all he was getting all these crazy symptoms he's never had before. I asked when it all started, he said the night he left. Later in the day we were talking about the med schedule he was put on, and he tells me he was started on Respirodol on the day he left. I was NOT happy. That drug is has several side effects that are COMMON, including increased anxiety, delusions, paranoia, and aggression. Not to mention the other side effects that are not as common but certainly not RARE... My daughter is a delusional paranoid schizophrenic who was on it, and she hated it because of the grogginess and feeling of being "under water". He says he is on it for anxiety. He is also taking Buspar, and Clonipine, and who knows what else. It gets changed, or he forgets/remembers/hides the medications daily.

    It seems like he is always going to be detoxing off something, until he can get the tools to learn how to deal with his cravings, and anxiety. It doesn't seem like the facility is really concerning themselves with the fact that he detoxes off one drug only because he is being put on another drug. When is he going to be told, "no more drugs, work on getting your MINDSET changed." He's off Subutex, has been for 24 hours. No Methadone, no Subutex. Oh, yeh... "they" also want to give him Vivitrol, for a year. "They" say that it is his best chance to stay clean and alive.

    All these drugs are becoming frightening. "They" keep telling him, "this is an easier kick" or "there is no kick from this" or "This helps with ______" or "its just to get you through detox". I honestly think that if he were to be handed a tic tac from a med cabinet and told, "this is a low dose benzo just to take the edge off withdrawals." he would believe it and then give me 4 reasons why it helps and he needs it.

    I keep getting told I dont understand the addicts mind. I keep getting told I dont understand because I am not withdrawing. What I DO know about an addicts mind is they will make every excuse under the sun to get a substance to deal with their underlying issues. Why is it that he is getting WAY better drugs in rehab?

    I thought it ironic that he was on the phone one night, standing in line... with all the other guys in the detox house, waiting for benzo's, tranqs, and other drugs. Funny in a dark twisted way.

    He may or may not have been "detox'd" too rapidly, but he's 3 weeks in. He's gotten past the stomach cramps, the vomiting, the seizure probability. He's through the worst of the anxiety (from what I can see and what he has said). He's gone through it all, made it through without leaving (again), isn't it time to stop giving him drugs and start giving him behavioral therapy? I mean, one on one, REAL therapy. Like, get to the core issues of his anxiety, paranoia, aggression, etc. Give him some TOOLS (not drugs) to deal with cravings, anxiety, paranoia. Cuz we all know that those are going to be an issue for the next 1-3 years, from PAWS. Since he was on so much methadone for so long, I am not kidding myself into thinking that he is going to come out all shiny new.

    He's spent 3 hours in group today. Apparently when he gets moved to the Recovery House (was supposed to be yesterday, then today, who knows when it will happen) there are 6-8 group meetings a day, and then I find out yesterday that if he doesnt attend he gets written up. ??????? He has to attend 6-8 group meetings a day (1+hrs each)? When does he see a therapist? I dont see how he can focus on HIMSELF, and his own recovery, and his own life and path if he is spending 50+hours a week in groups. Not to mention, what happened to ALL of this and EVERY aspect of it being VOLUNTARY? How does it help him to make it a punitive system?
  10. spring

    spring Administrator

    These group meetings are very helpful. Some of them are educational while some get down to the personal emotional and mental aspects of addiction. It helps to have others in the room to be our "mirrors" with much interaction and the give and take of it all.
    It helps to keep the addict constantly busy with these group meetings, giving them "homework" plus goals to set and work towards.

    One on one therapy doesn't usually start until the detox is complete and the addict is more stable physically, mentally and emotionally.

    I wish they would knock off the meds though. Maybe they're trying to keep him as comfortable as possible through this first stage of detox so he wont consider leaving again.
    Some of these symptoms sound like benzo w/d to me.
  11. Cianna

    Cianna Member

    Thanks for the response, Spring. He's been in 1-1 therapy since his 14th day there. I am with him during 2 Family sessions every saturday. There is 1.5 hour session with his Psychologist, and one 1.5 hour session with his case worker. He sees both as often as he likes. From what I can gather he sees each about 1x a week outside of when Im there.

    I do understand the drive to keep him in, and how his field trip is cause for concern. I guess for me, it would mean less drugs, more behavioral therapy. When he gets out into the real world he can't get all twisted in his brain and run off and use! I like that its a voluntary system, that he wasnt forced into this. I like that leaving is literally his own choice, and returning is his own choice. Voluntarily walking back into the facility is the beginning of him realizing that instead of USING, he can choose behavior that is healthier.

    There is nothing about any of this that is easy, but its grossly simple. The behavior needs to be changed. The behavior will never be changed if an addict is handed drugs at every junction of the process.

    Add to it, Ive begun noticing another issue. He seems to be much more agitated, paranoid, and anxious in the evenings. Almost a Sundowners effect. This is common with Dementia, markedly common in the elderly with Alzheimer's and other dementias. Its already been noted that the fact that he was functioning almost normally on 6mg of Xanax, 140mg Methadone, and binge drinking at night is insane. He was beginning to show Serotonin Syndrome, which is something that shook him and kind of the catalyst of his seeking treatment. While its common to have had a lot more neurologic long term damage from the amount of drugs he had taken prior to recovery, Im becoming afraid that its manifesting now. His job is VERY technical, one small mistake has the potential to cause a persons death. I still dont know how he did it for so long on Methadone, and then adding Xanax etc.
  12. Cianna

    Cianna Member

    There is zero that is voluntary about any of this, in addition, it literally is being forced.

    1. He wanted Alternative, he's in 12 Step - no beds in the Alternative house.
    2. He was told meetings are voluntary, they aren't. If he doesn't attend meetings, he will be written up.
    3. He was told he couldn't have his phone back without signing a promissory note that he would remain in their facility.
    4. He was told he would receive alternative treatment in the 12 Step house, the option is not available.
    5. He was told once at the Recovery House he would be able to have the ability to leave site for short periods of time. Now, he must obtain a sponsor, finish his workbook, and they will DISCUSS if he will be allowed to leave the facility.
    6. They told me that he couldn't take the Vivitrol until he had been off subs for a week (minimum). His last Subutex was Tuesday. His Vivitrol starts today. In fact, he is not able to move to the Recovery House until is has started the Vivitrol.

    He's currently out ice skating. They have gone on walks, mini golfing, etc.

    He's coming out of that place, and going to have a relationship with me. At what point do I have any say in the choices this facility is making for MY life? Its really starting to feel like the "Choice" to put him on Vivitrol... "Its a great option to keep his cravings at bay" as soon as I question the use of the drug, it became, "Its his only choice or die". He and I discussed what we wanted OUR life to look like after he left treatment. What I am ending up with is a total departure from what he and I agreed to as a couple for our lives.
  13. Cianna

    Cianna Member

    Oh lets not forget, they can't even get his mail to him. Literally, the answer is, "There is just so much of it, its really hard to get it to you the day it arrives."
  14. freakedout

    freakedout Moderator

    Sounds like he is doing a good job of getting you to feed off of/fuel his drama. Blaming somebody or something for problems instead of taking responsibility for the situation is very typical addict behavior.

    If he isn't court ordered, his stay is voluntary.

    I know your frustrated but the situation is out of your control. Until the excuses and blame games end, nothing will change.
  15. Cianna

    Cianna Member

    Im confused.

    Explain to me where this is his "blame game".

    He literally has been told, (in front of me) that following their program the way they lay it out is the only way for him to stay alive.

    He was told (in front of me) and I was told in separate conversations with his case worker that he would be given Alternative treatment and meetings are voluntary, not punitive. That means there isn't punishment for choosing to not attend.

    I was told directly by his worker, "I know the mail is an issue. We only have one person who picks it up..." When I asked why the mail can't be sent directly to the building he is residing in, addressed in the same manner, I was told, "its just not how we do it."

    Fuel his drama? If I didnt say anything, he would just simply tell me "oh, they are injecting me with Vivitrol today.", my response, "great!" There would be no drama. "I can't talk about going offsite still I finish my workbook and get a sponsor." My response, "ok babe, let me know when!" No drama.

    I guess the drama is me.

    Which, frankly, I expected. Really. Ive never dated anyone in The Program, cuz they weren't allowed to date me. Not that they were told per se' they couldn't, but more along the lines of the chances of me bucking their system. I have friends who are in The Program, they are encouraged to only be around others in The Program. If he stays with me, its like he is dating outside his faith. Sure, it can be done, but its not advisable.
  16. Cianna

    Cianna Member

    I dont even know why I am defending anything.

    You all may disagree, and I am sure you will.

    My BF today is not the same man that went into this facility. The man that went in actually came to conclusions on his own, thought options through, weighed them out. He didnt make great choices all the time, but at least he actually LOOKED at all his options.

    I feel like Im talking to a man brainwashed now.

    Im going to leave the forum. He's fine, he has got recovered addicts telling him what drugs he needs to stay alive, and the kind of people he needs to be around. I guess Im just pissed that the plans he and I made for our future are now gone, and the life I had chosen to live is no longer what he wants. I knew this would be the case, and I am not surprised. Doesn't make it hurt any less.

    Thanks for all the input,

    best to you all.
  17. freakedout

    freakedout Moderator

    Hey Cianna,

    Leaving because you hear something you don't want to isn't going to help you or him.

    I have been where he is. There is NO facility, program, medication regime, counselors, etc that he is going to be happy with right now.

    What you describe suggests he is doing the typical self sabotage thing (been there) where he has already decided he isn't serious about getting and staying clean. He is probably somewhat ambivalent and goes back and forth on his thinking on this. But his behavior is what is important.

    You won't like this, but it needs to be said.... He will constantly complain and build up a laundry list of "reasons" why the facility isn't helping him. Getting you to agree with the reasons is his goal because this gives him reinforcement / excuses for using when he leaves. You agreeing with him is what he wants, helps you two bond, and is the perfect setup for using again.

    This is one of the MANY ways "co dependency" sabotages recovery. The toughest thing for someone who loves an addict is realizing (truly) that you have no control over the situation.

    I hope the best for you and him. Good luck on your journey.

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