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ODR Book Club/ Books for recovery from addiction

Discussion in '~ Articles ~ Info ~ Links ~ Data ~' started by Arrie, Jul 5, 2004.

  1. OnMyWay

    OnMyWay Well-Known Member

    I'm going to be reading 2666 by Roberto Bola?o with an online book club if anyone is interested! This website originally formed this summer to read Infinite Jest, and they had some incredible conversations regarding IJ, so I'm totally psyched. The website is infinitesummer.org and they are reading 2666 in Jan/Feb. :)
  2. gettingbetter

    gettingbetter Well-Known Member

    Are there deadlines? I hate anyone telling me what to do. Typical addict. :)
  3. OnMyWay

    OnMyWay Well-Known Member

    haha! well might it help to look at them as "suggestions"? :D
  4. gettingbetter

    gettingbetter Well-Known Member

    That was one of my favorite parts of IJ, incidentally: the whole 'suggestion' deal/analysis.

    Trigger, I love Valley of the Dolls too. No shame. How does Liny remind you of Anne? That fascinates me.

    Since we're all probably Neelys, the Annes of the world baffle me.
  5. guinevere64

    guinevere64 Well-Known Member

    been a howling fantod today, reading CONSIDER THE LOBSTER, specifically the essay about usage and authority...

    and guess what. the mofo misspells "sesquipedalian." FN25 p. 81: spells it "sesquipidelian."

    bet he even mispronounced it (if he ever actually used the word orally--or, as most people say, "verbally")

    makes it hard to fu ckin look it up in the dictionary when the author can't even bloody spell it. thank god for google's alternative search suggestions.

    ok, i'll "own" my resentment and say i was raised pretty much as DFW was: by a mother obsessively attentive to usage. i am a "descriptive linguist" by graduate training but a SNOOT by nature and early childhood experience. :) --G

    p.s. i had planned on reading IJ but i gave away my copy to a former student who won an award for an essay emulating DFW that he wrote for my course... have to get another copy.
  6. Mic

    Mic Guest

    Please explain what you mean about oral vs. verbal and what you mean by "most people".

    If you'd be so kind...one of my pet peeves is use of the word "utilize" when "use" works just fine. I've consulted a number of dictionaries and writing guides, and still don't understand the distinction and hence, use. I prefer concise writing.


    <center>It Takes What It Takes</center>
  7. guinevere64

    guinevere64 Well-Known Member

    Mic... i totally came off as an ass... sorry! i was tired after a lovely day.

    "oral" v. "verbal"... we have a joke in our family. i think we were listening to the radio or TV or something, and somebody said they'd made a "verbal agreement." my hb and i just looked at each other, and my hb said: "as opposed to what--a danced agreement?"

    "verbal" means anything using words--spoken or written.

    "oral" means via the mouth (as you may have guessed)--or spoken.

    so what the guy really meant was, he'd made an oral agreement. :)

    "use" v. "utilize" is also a funny one, and i happen to agree with you. "use" does the job in 99 percent of cases. "utilize" is a fancy way of saying "to allow something to make use of."

    i didn't "utilize" drugs, for example. i used... cheers and happy christmas-- g
  8. Sluggo

    Sluggo Well-Known Member

    out of sheer boredom and hoped distraction...I looked it up...cause I agree with Mic - a verbal agreement means 'spoken'...as opposed to 'written'...at least according to Merriam Webster.

    i often don't use words correctly, spell correctly, or use proper punctuation. judge me or judge me not...no matter to me. i am what i am and that's all that i am...or so says Popeye.
  9. guinevere64

    guinevere64 Well-Known Member

    it's a minor technical point i was writing about. ... as Wallace notes in his essay, dictionaries like Merriam Webster are usually more accepting of common usages. so what "most people" "usually say" becomes codified as "correct" when it appears in a widely used reference work like Webster.

    my point exactly...

    i guess i was writing to the other howling fantods (DFW fans) on the board, who don't seem to have logged on... but i was trying to say that in practice i usually accept common usage (i do so with my students, for example--unlike Wallace), and by childhood brainwashing i am someone (a "SNOOT") who notices usages that are potentially problematic. ... i only do this because words are one of my stocks in trade... and i try to laugh at myself laughing at others. which was actually my main point... to laugh at myself :D but i guess i didn't pull it off

    happy boxing day!... --g
  10. Sluggo

    Sluggo Well-Known Member

    yep....I'm 'most people'. thanks for clarifying that.

    but 'laugh at myself for laughing at others'? i'm sure I provide much material to laugh at....(hoping I phrased that correctly).;)

  11. Mic

    Mic Guest


    Thanks for splainin'. BTW, you SO didn't come off as an ass atall! I'm genuinely interested in this subject. :) Your take on use/ utilize is a common perception....

    I'm like J: "i often don't use words correctly, spell correctly, or use proper punctuation. judge me or judge me not...no matter to me." with a single exception, when the subject is writing and grammar. ;) Say for example: I was an hour late to a surprise party, much to the dismay of the host.

    A) I feel bad about that.
    B) I feel badly about that.

    It is NOT badly, it is bad!! Feeling badly implies that ones ability to feel is impaired, which clearly isn't what's being communicated! I'm finished now. :D


    Maybe I don't know myself very well. How in the world can I claim to be like J above, and in the next breath share my disdain for poor word choice about showing up late to the party?

    <center>It Takes What It Takes</center>
  12. peacenik

    peacenik Administrator

    or verbalizing [}:)]

  13. guinevere64

    guinevere64 Well-Known Member

    mic... maybe because you're human? i dunno.

    and you're right about "bad" v. "badly"! :)

    much love (and laughter, at/with/because of the foibles of humanity)... --G
  14. gettingbetter

    gettingbetter Well-Known Member

    I have an issue with the original post that started this discussion, which is somewhat ironic ...

    One can HAVE the 'howling fantods' ... can one actually BE a 'howling fantod'?

    All of you suck for making me think about grammar on Christmas vacation. I don't even grade for spelling/grammar most of the time. :)

    EDITED TO ADD THAT: I do not care if I am right or wrong either way. It is an interesting point to me and that is all.
  15. OnMyWay

    OnMyWay Well-Known Member

    nope, you definitely can't be one. it's like the willies... you can't be a willy. you just get them sometimes.

    and i wonder if dfw purposely mispelled "sesquipidelian" to give it a slightly altered meaning? he did sometimes make up his own words. just a thought. i agree, though, that it doesn't help improve a reader's vocabulary to look up a word and find nothing in the dictionary.
  16. guinevere64

    guinevere64 Well-Known Member

    this speaks my mind, Danielle, thanks.

    and thanks for the correction on my usage of "howling fantods." !! shoot, i'm happy to be wrong about something. when it comes down to a choice between being happy and being right, these days i pick the former.

    finally, thanks for getting me started back on DFW. i'm REALLY enjoying it.

    my three-point gratitude list for today.

    merry Third Day of Christmas. :) --g

    p.s.: Ariel, he did make up a word in the same footnote. "Heliogabaline." i was so interested by that list of words that i looked up every word i didn't recognize. and i wonder, if he did change the spelling of "sesquipedalian," what his intent was? hm. ... did you guys read that essay?
  17. guinevere64

    guinevere64 Well-Known Member

    I think it's important to note that, Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning?


  18. spring

    spring Administrator

    A book I just finished; "My Decent into Death" by Howard Storm.

    The true story of an aetheist who had a near death experience.

    Well, he actually died for a short time and was immediately faced with demons ready to take him to the depths of hell until he heard a "voice" telling him to pray to God.
    Since he had never prayed except for a little bit he learned in preschool Sunday school many years ago, he said what he knew..."Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for thou art with me. For purple mountains majesty, Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord. Deliver us from evil. One nation under God. God bless America".

    It was enough to cause a pinpoint sized light to appear out of the pitch-black darkness he was in. And as it got bigger, he felt the most warming sense of love he had ever known....and I'll leave it right there.

    The question and answer period was a real eye-opener. It was a wonderful story and even though I am already a believer, his story gave me even more hope about my future here on earth and further understanding about the true nature of God.

  19. spring

    spring Administrator

    I saw that author Howard Storm on the History channel the other night. Cant remember the show now...had something to do with hell called "The Gates of hell"? maybe? Anyway, it was an interesting documentary for those who are seeking answers about spirtuality and the afterlife. I'm sure it will be repeated since this is October and Halloween is coming up.
  20. Torushima

    Torushima Well-Known Member


    Hey, ODR'ers --

    I thought that it'd be pretty cool to generate some discussion on reading material. Whether be news articles, blog posts, instruction manuals for your new toaster oven or books, I'm sure we all have some insight worth sharing -- recovery-based or otherwise.

    Here's what I'm reading at the moment:

    "Kingdom of Fear" by Hunter S. Thompson
    An anthology of formative experiences from the original gonzo journalist -- and one of my major influences as a writer. "Fear in Loathing in Las Vegas" was based on one of his books.

    "Carrie" by Stephen King
    His first book, written in 1974.

    "John Lennon: The Life" by Philip Norman
    This one's a monster -- over 800 pages -- and I'm really excited to learn more about one of my heroes. Just started it today.

    Harry Potter
    All of them. I just started "The Order of the Phoenix" tonight and for me, it's pure fantasy escapism. If I'm feeling bummed out, depressed, lethargic or grappling with any other of the 10,000,000 issues that recovery dredges to the surface, I've found that a trip to Hogwart's kicks major Muggle arse -- but it may be the beginning of a new addiction.

    So, what are you reading?

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